You can submit your questions to Dr. Drill via e-mail to : DrDrill@CadetStuff.org.

Dr. Drill,

Victor Laveaga

Dr. Drill responds

Thanks for writing to Dr. Drill. This is the first time I've ever received a question about drill for non-military uniformed services and I have to say: "Thanks a lot!" Yeah, thanks a lot for making me do all that digging through the internet and wading through reams of documents. Thanks, buddy; same to ya!

Actually, the Doctor didn't have to dig that much: that's what he has minions for. "Nurse! I need everything you can find out about fire service drill, STAT! Hmm... I like the way the line runs up the back of those stockings..."

But, never mind that now; let's tackle your question.

It turns out there isn't a single codified set of rules for drill for fire services. Every department can pretty much do things its own way. I did, however, come across this fairly authoritative looking article, which said in part:

When it comes to the basics like marching, color guard movement and flag etiquette, honor guard is the same for police and fire departments, says Stuart Smith, an arson investigator and former volunteer firefighter. However, there are some differences that fire honor guards must practice that police do not.

Firefighters have a different manual of arms. Typically, they carry polished axes or pike poles instead of rifles. Instead of a hearse, a firefighter's casket may ride on a fire engine. This detail requires about 14 people instead of the traditional eight needed to move a casket in and out of a hearse, says Smith. Students practice placing a casket on top of a the engine using steps and ramps. Instead of a gun salute, tribute often is paid with the ringing of a bell during a final alarm or bell ceremony, signifying a firefighter has gone home for the final time. At the end of a graveside service, when police officers might lay carnations on the casket, firefighters might pass by the casket to each ring a bell once as they leave.

Sorry Victor, back to you...

Dr. Drill then found the very helpful staff of the Goshen Indiana Police Department Honor Guard Academy, who train policemen throughout their region in professional level drill and ceremonies. Randy Kantner, who runs the Academy, was kind enough to take the time to tell me that there also isn't a single codified drill manual for police departments:

... We discovered while forming our Honor Guard unit, that there is no written policy regarding drill & ceremony for the Police & Fire Service Honor Guards. Most units subscribe to the manual for one of the military branches, usually whichever branch is represented within the respective units. When we started our Honor Guard Camps, one of the objectives was to standardize the Drill & Ceremony for public service Honor Guards. The manual we teach is mostly based on the Army FM 22 with some modifications. ...

Victor, you still here? Oh yes, where was I?

Of course, neither FM 22-5 nor FM 3-21.5 answer your question, which is: do firemen salute during colors. Happily, there's a general guideline for that which transcends all services. "Nurse! United States Code Title 4, STAT! Yeah, that's it; a little more to the right..."

Okay, flag etiquette is governed by the United States Code, Title 4. A quick look through "Chapter 1 - THE FLAG" reveals this:

Sec. 9. Conduct during hoisting, lowering or passing of flag

During the ceremony of hoisting or lowering the flag or when the flag is passing in a parade or in review, all persons present except those in uniform should face the flag and stand at attention with the right hand over the heart. Those present in uniform should render the military salute. When not in uniform, men should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Aliens should stand at attention. The salute to the flag in a moving column should be rendered at the moment the flag passes

Notice that it doesn't say "Those present in military uniform...", it merely says uniform. Another section of 4 USC I thought was relevant was this:

Sec. 8. Respect for flag

(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations.

Notice here that 4 USC lumps firemen in with military personnel as far as uniforms are concerned. That pretty much puts the nail in it for me!

So, to make a long answer short, Victor: it would seem that if firefighters are present and in uniform when the colors are presented (or retreated), you should stand at attention and render a salute - just like the military and Boy Scouts do.

I hope this helps, and remember Our Motto: "Everybody Wants Some!"

Dr. Drill.